Comments on: Of Popes and Principles http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/ I say quite deliberately that the Christian religion, as organized in its churches, has been and still is the principal enemy of moral progress in the world. --Bertrand Russell Wed, 10 Mar 2010 01:49:32 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7.1 hourly 1 By: victor http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/comment-page-1/#comment-10 victor Thu, 19 Jul 2007 16:54:29 +0000 http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/#comment-10 In a way this issue of succession has been addressed already in the discussion of Donatus. He believed that the efficacy of the sacraments depended upon the morality of the minister. This was rejected as heresy. If we were to carry this over to the sacrament of ordination wouldn't the efficacy of it be inherent just as well as with Baptism and the Eucharist? In a way this issue of succession has been addressed already in the discussion of Donatus. He believed that the efficacy of the sacraments depended upon the morality of the minister. This was rejected as heresy. If we were to carry this over to the sacrament of ordination wouldn’t the efficacy of it be inherent just as well as with Baptism and the Eucharist?

]]> By: ericaustinlee http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/comment-page-1/#comment-7 ericaustinlee Mon, 16 Jul 2007 19:51:50 +0000 http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/#comment-7 I wonder what the Focolare would say about this. They are the ecumenical movement of the Roman Catholic church, started by Chiara Lubich in the late 1940's. Tiana and I recently presented at their Mariapolis retreat here in SD a couple weeks ago... hmm, we should ask our friend Ester in the Focolare to see what she thinks. It's pretty baffling to me as well. If it really all comes down to 'apostolic succession', I once heard somebody make the comment that, "you'd think, for all Christ forgives us for in our lives, you'd think that if we can't show the apostolic succession card among our deck, that you'd think we'd be forgiven of that too?" Peace, Eric I wonder what the Focolare would say about this. They are the ecumenical movement of the Roman Catholic church, started by Chiara Lubich in the late 1940’s. Tiana and I recently presented at their Mariapolis retreat here in SD a couple weeks ago… hmm, we should ask our friend Ester in the Focolare to see what she thinks. It’s pretty baffling to me as well.

If it really all comes down to ‘apostolic succession’, I once heard somebody make the comment that, “you’d think, for all Christ forgives us for in our lives, you’d think that if we can’t show the apostolic succession card among our deck, that you’d think we’d be forgiven of that too?”

Peace,

Eric

]]> By: victor http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/comment-page-1/#comment-6 victor Sun, 15 Jul 2007 06:53:03 +0000 http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/#comment-6 yes, Ratzinger was head of the committee that created the document before election to the chair of Peter. Does make you wonder if maybe there were those in places of power who didn't like the open authenticity that was so characteristic of John Paul II. yes, Ratzinger was head of the committee that created the document before election to the chair of Peter. Does make you wonder if maybe there were those in places of power who didn’t like the open authenticity that was so characteristic of John Paul II.

]]> By: Jon http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/comment-page-1/#comment-4 Jon Sat, 14 Jul 2007 21:23:44 +0000 http://brainwrecker.com/christianity/of-popes-and-principles/#comment-4 i think one of the really unfortunate things is the way that this reflects on all of the good work of the previous pope (John Paul II) and the huge strides forward made even before that by the catholic church in the 1960's. i'm suspicious, though, because the document was issued by the congregation for the doctrine of the faith, which the pope headed before his election into infallibility. i'm sure this document was on somebody's desk when benedict was headed up the congregation (and was still capable of fallacy). i wonder, though, if this was something on his agenda from day one, most likely even before. Essentially, i believe that the document says that other churches are not churches because they can't trace their lineage to the original disciples. he is essentially bringing back to the forefront the same ideas that caused the split in the eastern and western churches, and sparked the reformation a few hundred years later. anyway, protestants are deeply offended once again by the arcane politics of the catholic church. hey, at least we (protestants) have something in common with muslims now. jon i think one of the really unfortunate things is the way that this reflects on all of the good work of the previous pope (John Paul II) and the huge strides forward made even before that by the catholic church in the 1960’s. i’m suspicious, though, because the document was issued by the congregation for the doctrine of the faith, which the pope headed before his election into infallibility. i’m sure this document was on somebody’s desk when benedict was headed up the congregation (and was still capable of fallacy). i wonder, though, if this was something on his agenda from day one, most likely even before.

Essentially, i believe that the document says that other churches are not churches because they can’t trace their lineage to the original disciples. he is essentially bringing back to the forefront the same ideas that caused the split in the eastern and western churches, and sparked the reformation a few hundred years later.

anyway, protestants are deeply offended once again by the arcane politics of the catholic church. hey, at least we (protestants) have something in common with muslims now.

jon

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